karen rain haberman

Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Sorry to hear that you got assaulted by Jois, too. I totally agree with you, Karen, that sexual abuse is not about sex. . But thats because theres this great big vacuum. Right. And he recently also sponsored a petition thats on Facebook, trying to get Ashtanga certified and authorized teachers to make accountability statements. That crossed my desk a little while ago and I did very much appreciate that. www.matthewremski.com/wordpress/karen-rain-speaks-about-pattabhi-jois-and-recovering-from-sexual-and-spiritual-abuse-video-interview/. By that point, I'm talking to Karen Rain for two years. If you feel this work is helpful in a way that you would like to support, good wishes and contributions are deeply appreciated. After years of healing my knees came good and I have a well-going daily Ashtanga practice 20 years on. Like I bring up the metaphor in the book that if you broke a persons leg and there they were on the ground, you wouldnt blame them for not running away from you as you came in to damage them further. Touched a lot by the common ground dealing with this allegations and reinterpretation of behaviour that still continues in my own world of trying to educate people to escape the Buddhist flavoured abusive high demand groups. No, no. What psychiatrists came up with in the 1950s where they self imposed theyre starting to break it with Trump now but a lot of professional clinicians, have this self-imposed rule that theyre not going to diagnose people that theyre not in clinical practice with. And if they were watching other people being assaulted, what kind of secrets are their bodys holding and as I said in the beginning, these are some of the reasons why I was scared to go into this material because its really deep. You know, there are very few, I would imagine in North America and Europe, yoga teachers who are cranking people today the way that Jois cranked people in his day. I would like also to thank you, Karen, for being so clear in your interview what constitutes assault and going through all the intellectualizations and rationalisations, that are trying to explain KP Jois behaviour away. And this is what happened to us and this is how we feel about what will create safety and respect, not only for us, but for students going forward. And its something about that interpretability that is like essential to his magic, usually his magic that, that you never know quite what hes doing. I know youre not found at this guy and I think I have mixed feelings about myself, but I was glancing through Jordan, Jordan Petersons book and he makes some comment that I think is really relevant here where he says you know, if we deny a victim response, some responsibility, we deny them agency. In following you, I know that you have your eyes on many different yoga and Buddhist meditative spiritual communities that have lots of these bad dynamics at play. The problem that I dont think Jordan Peterson or any of his kind of like alt right bros want to really face is that you cannot be responsible for having been deceived. The problem with that is that there might be some, some therapeutic application of that principle of well, You know, in this moment, do you feel as though you have agency with regard to how youre moving forward coming out of this experience. I made a few attempts to discuss these things with senior teachers (I was a newie then and didnt practise enough series to be taken seriously) but the response was usually along the lines of Do your practice and all is coming or Yoga is 99% practice and 1% theory. So theres tools in there and the tools are accompanied by personal essay questions for review. So talk about that: the sexual objectification, with Jois. And the deception around it too. So I mean, okay. "Where did Karen Haberman go? Still I was both sexually assaulted and violently adjusted by Jois on his visits to the States, as I detailed in Matthews article. See my privacy policy to learn more about how I use data. The project that I had started with was a broader research project into injuries in yoga classes or in yoga practice. And we have endowed it with a kind of orientalist idealistic mysticism, and that has become one of its main selling points. I have known Karen as Karen Haberman and have practised close to her for around 10 or 11 months through 1996 and 1997 in KP Jois little Lakshmipuram studio. I actually regret not making that clear in the book. And so what that means is that theyre saying that a technique that Jois developed in the late sixties and changed several times as his shala got busier, theyre implying that that is traditional in a way. Visit the archive for a tidy list of all my articles. Not that he really gave a protocol: he assaulted people. You have no idea what was going on in Chogyam Trungpas head, you have no idea what, what the inner life of Bikram Choudhury is like. Find the latest phone number, email address, home address and more ThatsThem for free. Karen L Haberman View Antarctic krill (Euphausia superba) is a keystone species in the Antarctic pelagic ecosystem (Everson 2000;Knox 2007;Trathan and Hill 2016) and also supports a major fishery . I dont think so. Karen Rain, formerly Haberman, was one of six students in a very early-days video of Pattabhi Jois directing them through the Primary series, that I had watched repeatedly on mute. And so I dont think its a big leap for people to go, Oh, well maybe I shouldnt be so uptight about such and such, or maybe I shouldnt, ask too many questions, or thats private after all. Thanks so much for coming on. So you know, I appreciate your confession. As he stepped up forcefully from behind, he found it hard to catch his balance and had to hold on to my shoulders to not fall over me. Learn how your comment data is processed. So its not, its not a surprise that these things get wrapped up to together and sold on and end up rationalizing abuse to me. Meanwhile, their colleagues are not supposed to be looking. And there havent been, to my satisfaction, statements of distancing and denouncing and separation and all that. And hes published a lot of really beautiful pieces about that are basically, What the heck were we doing? I mean, for me its positive because there isnt that much, worth following on Facebook. I know were closing in on your time a bit and I do want to get into maybe the path ahead. So, you know, those are individual choices for sure. Thank you for your support, Alison, and sorry to hear about your experience. But part of the story that started building up around him was that this is what he was doing was that he wasnt digitally raping that woman, he was helping her find her mulabandha, which is a term for an internal muscular, but also esoteric, sensation that is tied to the rise of Kundalini or esoteric energy. Or about Bikram Choudhury, although less so, more and more people would see him clearly for who he is. Every day, Karen Rain and thousands of other voices read, write, and share important stories on Medium. What kind of reform I know you mentioned things like more of a consent culture in terms of adjustments and scope of practice considerations. Ive spent two years interviewing Karen Rain. Thank you for helping to free yoga from the clutches of patriarchy and misogyny. What would you like to see, see moving forward? Lets turn modern Ashtanga Yoga into a collective of equals where teachers are mere facilitators and servants of growth for students. I mean it didnt have to be me. Warm regards And the cover-up is still going on. All of that intentionality, all of that speculation on peoples internal states, what it usually does is it overshadows the fact that a crime has been committed and we can obviously set up ways of preventing it from happening again. I watched it for the pleasure of watching a pre-digital . Karen Haberman +95 +94 +93 +91 . Karen M. (Haberman) Golson . During my last stay in Mysuru in 1999 I shared all of my doubts with a friend. Amongst the people who do, this is a difficult book to read and some people have really negative reactions to it. And its something that Yoga Alliance may adopt in part, not because I wrote it or anything, but because its in the air now theyre doing a renovation of their standards after 19 years. ABOUT LOGIN SIGN UP. Prior to that, I was a Hausdorff Postdoc at the Hausdorff Center for MathematicsLink opens in a new window at the University of Bonn and a member of Prof Karl-Theodor SturmLink opens in a new windows group on Stochastic and Geometric Analysis at the Institute for Applied MathematicsLink opens in a new window. And you know, the relationship between the teacher and the student is sacred. Theyre supposed to be concentrating on their breath or theres even eye positions that people are supposed to take. And then that second layer of isolation leads to a kind of internal isolation from your own moral sense, where its like you had values that helped you navigate the world. They wanted to indigenize these physical culture practices, as forms of national physical culture, but also anti-colonial pride building. But when I first got into yoga, just to put a context on this, when I first got into yoga and started hanging around and studios that had an Ashtanga Yoga program, I did hear these whispers around certain kinds of adjustments and that the euphemism that was given for this kind of very intimate genital touch was called a mulabandha check. Where was your newspaper report? 2 Ditonton. . Karen lived in 1974, at address, Wisconsin. Work Experience. And often that would happen within the of adjustments. I didnt initially. And so I didnt actually you asked the question and I didnt want to go on a rant about . You can update your cookie preferences at any time. And the format was quite broad. This is a great apple! There was like five likes to it. Also lets not BS about history and philosophy either because its becoming increasingly clear and I want to cite my colleagues Theodore Wildcroft here for coming up with this analogy its becoming increasingly clear that Yoga teachers are not physiotherapists. Karen Haberman 1958 Karen Haberman, born Circa 1958. I hate that phrase, but I think theres theres nothing to have been done about it. This is hardcore. So she starts to build numbers out of what she personally experienced and what she personally witnessed. I will address you, Karen, now directly and will get Matthew to forward you my response. Karen Rain: Abuse in Ashtanga Yoga. I was trying through the night to remember how close your mat must have been to mine. When I spun around I saw what looked to me like him grabbing her buttocks and rubbing himself against her while he stood between her legs and she was back arching. And then thats what gets exported to the world is the notion that Joiss system is ancient or that it goes back to Patanjali, or something like that when theres no evidence for that at all. I proved that I think in my book by citing the work of several historians of medieval yoga, or one in particular, Dr Jason Birch, who says theres no evidence for anybody physically assisting anybody else in a yoga posture prior to the 20th century. . It may be good to add your voice. And she comes up with a conservative estimate of 300 or, sorry, 30,000 individual sexual assaults over whats likely a 30 year period. But the whole notion that the teachers should always have their hands or should have their hands on a student at all times that comes from his particular pedagogy. The old shala held 12 mats and my spot was front row, left corner in the 4:30am time slot. I found them very valuable and will continue to read all. Karen Rain, 56. Lived In Amherst MA, Mill Valley CA. And it was probably widely known within the upper echelons of the Ashtanga world, even into, even as early as 2012 but of course, we now know it was far earlier than that. What does Karen Rain have to say? What we need here is a Truth and Reconciliation process and it needs to start with the truth. And thats it, right? Yes, this seems to be a common story. Thats a whole orchard. But I think that the basic ideas around what pain means, what injury means, what pushing yourself means, what being pushed by a teacher means: those have all remained intact in places. I think I have two feelings about this question. How do the spiritual metaphysics factor in to this cocktail of toxic group dynamic? Hopemissema. And he actually describes being brutalized by Krishnamacharya being beaten as he learned to do asanas. And I think I really have the work of Alexandra Stein to thank for that because she uses this basic so just a caveat here, when we talk about the psychology of person whos victimized by a cult, its not to say that, you know, there was something inside them that made them more vulnerable. What did you actually learn? whether for the first time Iyengar is responsible for the notion that the bodily postures that we assume in yoga should some sort of geometrical form and balance and symmetry and a kind of architecture of grace. I thought that that part in the book was great. And then there are a psychological processes that can take over that make recruitment easier, dependency, easier, dread of leading, easier but what she says is that the main thing that the cult does is it rewires your way of relating to people, to everyone, really towards the end of the attachment spectrum, known as disorganized, where youre actually in a constant state of love and fear of approaching, but withdrawing, of going to a person for love who on some level is also hurting you, but you feel dependent upon. Lets stop projecting our power on gurus and lets cease worshipping people who insist on passing on knowledge and especially sacred knowledge in vertical relationships. Sharaths spot was front right and I think you practised next to him. In Joiss circumstance it becomes really complicated because one of the things that the Ashtanga world has prided itself on for the last 30 years is the sense that the teacher is able to learn and know about the student intimately because they are having personal interactions with them multiple times per morning, every morning, six mornings per week, two hours per session, two days off per month. You can download the mp3 here. Hes probably BKS Iyengars most famous, most prominent, most senior student, and the one who most embodies his own teaching persona. Now here I am talking about providing a safe space where you can heal but I have to actually thank you for providing a safe space to me where I can come out. So he was doing that or he was helping her heal from sexual trauma. Questioning the guru was certainly considered theory. Hopemissema. It can apply to other forms of knowledge as well. Thank you, Karen Rain, and Gregor Maehle. Does it raise my profile? Major dark underbelly. Someone shared something you had blogged about, about abuse and some of these problematic dynamics in the yoga world. Previously, I was a postdoctoral fellow in the Laboratoire Jacques-Louis Lions at Sorbonne Universit with Prof Ugo Boscain and a member of the Inria Paris team CAGE. and I kept coming back for more. And then we have this sort of like contemporary bastardized version of the term thats used to pretend that the people who are the people who are using it have something, you know, magical or special when thats really deceptive. Opportunistic. You are my sunshine [silent separation] # Yang ming,Huang xioming. I mean, thats just, thats basic adulting for one thing. Karen M. (Haberman) Golson was born c. 1955. Recently, Karen and LaRhonda Steele have founded the duo "The Spirit of Freedom" which showcases the songs of the Civil Rights Movement and their relevance to then and now. I studied Asthanga yoga for 10 years in the 90s but somehow avoided going to Mysore. Previously, I was a postdoctoral fellow in the Laboratoire Jacques-Louis Lions at Sorbonne Universit with Prof Ugo Boscain and a member of the Inria Paris team CAGE. Theres also 16 women who said He assaulted me, and this is how he did it. One is enough. Thank you so much Gregor Maehle for your beautiful, honest, insightful and heartfelt response to my interview. And I dont think I addressed this in the book either except, except where I get into the fact that especially a Tantric and Hatha Yoga history is filled with analysis and thought and practice around the sublimation of sexual energies. Love and respect! People asked for like a decade. He was able to publish their testimonies. Theres something plausible about it. Your email address will not be published. In my case, it was, in my case, it was Michael Roach of the Asian Classics Institute or Charles Anderson at Endeavor Academy. So people are capable of all kinds of BS when it comes to the interpretability of the magical person. Right. "Maybe This Time". Now thats new. And so thats really cool. That might happen privately in therapy later, but what happens is, and I can hear it in that quote, is that the notion of victim is turned into a kind of psychological state instead of a label for somebody against whom a crime has been committed. I have known Karen as Karen Haberman and have practised close to her for around 10 or 11 months through 1996 and 1997 in KP Jois little Lakshmipuram studio. Karen Haberman Entrepreneur and Internet Visionary Hawthorne, New Jersey, United States. (courtesy of Karen Rain) Jois died in . I am glad that I strongly advised any of my students not to go there. Previously, I was a postdoctoral fellow in the Laboratoire Jacques-Louis LionsLink opens in a new window at Sorbonne Universit with Prof Ugo BoscainLink opens in a new window and a member of the Inria ParisLink opens in a new window team CAGELink opens in a new window. Looking for info on Karen Haberman? . And also Id say that its Joiss senior students coming out of his tutelage from the late Sixties, but then especially into the 80s that really give modern yoga its aesthetic in terms of its incredible athleticism, its beautiful, but sometimes scary contortionism. So even with people that were initially critical, theyve read the book and they feel that this is a very fair, balanced treatment and important that its out now. You know, theyre attached to money. Sometimes as early as 4, 4:30 AM. Love scar [ Flower Rain] EP.3 #Jerry Yan, Karen Mok. I hope that slowly gets in. Youve lost your old friends probably, or youve written them off or theyre not enlightened enough for you, or youre just separated from them because youre in an ashram or something. View Details. And, and thats why I started to use the language of cult analysis to describe how it actually happened. He was born in 1915. I hope that people are able to begin to look at the communities that they live in a little bit more critically, to look at the kind of leadership that they have a little bit more critically and start modelling that critical thinking. So thats moving slowly. Please dont feel bad thinking that you could have or should have done something differently. I watched it on mute because there was something vaguely military about Jois' staccato Sanskrit counts. Theres this sense that you and the teacher are alone and there are people who absolutely love and they thrive on that and theres no reason they shouldnt. Look up Karen Rain's phone number, home address, email address, and other personal information. I am deeply sorry. I never really pursued Ashtanga yoga myself. And, and, you know, its like, did you, did anybody say that, Ronan Farrow was opportunistic for reporting on Harvey Weinstein? It happens to mediocrely educated people. And I still have Shadow Pose as kind of like a book structure. As an ashtanga yoga practitioner for the last 30 + years who has been physically (and emotionally) injured by physical assists in ashtanga vinyasa classes, I honor you both for your honesty, courage, and integrity. Theres always something mysterious or like, or a little bit beyond or childlike or innocent or super spiritual about the leader, about Mr. Jois or about Manouso Manos. I am Josh Summers. To me, virtue signaling is, you know, some sort of opportunistic self aggrandizement based upon associating yourself with you a fashionable social cause. Most recently youve written a book about problematic group dynamics in the yoga world and its called Practice and All is Coming: Abuse, Cult Dynamics and Healing in Yoga, and Beyond. How can I make this up to her? I am asking myself how I could not notice the extent to which these things were going on. More importantly I think there needs to be a disclaimer that Sharath has any form of guru status, that he knows our bodies better than we do. They said: This practice will give you spiritual liberation and if you follow this teachers instructions as closely as you can and you surrender your body up to them, your process will go a lot faster. My office is in Room 2.14 in the Mathematical Sciences Building. Thats like a bad apple and a whole bunch of people saying, No, this is great. And Greg Nardi from Orlando or Fort Lauderdale, Florida. I am concerned that the wool is still being pulled over the eyes of young, unsuspecting people. And it had started with the strange realization that everybody that I knew who had professionalized into the yoga world or who was a really dedicated student was injured in some way. Well actually, you know, I just want to interject too, is that the people that Im in contact with, that had said that actually have read the book and have actually completely changed their tune. So just to say that this is a style where unlike a typical led class: if someone were to go to a regular yoga studio or a gym and the teacher would sort of take them through a sequence, talking them through, maybe adjusting at times but in the Mysore system, students show up quite early in the morning. Bless you. But we dont have any evidence that physical adjustments in yoga existed prior to the 1920s. A book is a different thing, you know, when its editorialized and fact checked and theres legal backing of publication behind it, its 380 pages long and theres 380 foot notes or whatever, its well-cooked. Except that hes going to use that to say that we somehow as observers of the victim have to give them responsibility within our assessment of what happened during a particular crime. It was the students who said these things about him. This conversation covers topics like sexual abuse that might be sensitive to some . You are Matthew Remski, a yoga teacher as well also an industry consultant in the Yoga Industry and an author of several books. Even just recently Sharath has accepted the title parama guru, claiming the fact that he is the only true representative of an ancient lineage and the only person to authorize teachers, etc. Ive really enjoyed talking to you and Im really super appreciative of the work youre doing. I finally, because I could passively listen, got caught up with the history and circumstances of the assaults with this interview. She is survived by her four children Amy (Richard) Stathus, James (Jessica) Habermann, Heather (Nolan) Long, and Ashley (Brendan) Thibault along with her thirteen grandchildren Jennifer, Devin, Derek, Amber, Erica, Collette, Alexander, Henry, Cali, Deacon, Hadley . The year when you left, 1998, I wasnt there. He can teach Manouso Manos Yoga tomorrow and open up shop wherever, maybe in Bali or something. Gregor. On file we have 38 email addresses and 35 phone numbers associated with Karen in area codes such as 256, 608, 541, 970, 909, and 13 other area codes. It happens to people who arent educated at all. Shiva Details: Visitors are welcome to return to the residence Sunday after the conclusion of the burial at the cemetery, and visitation will continue from 7:00 p.m. to 9:00 p.m. Shiva visits Monday and Tuesday from 2:00 p.m. to 4:00 p.m. and 7:00 p.m. to 9:00 p.m. Evening services will be held daily at 7:00 p.m. I am a Harrison Early Career Assistant Professor in the Department of Statistics at the University of Warwick. People who have that response really have to get educated in what it means to be in a toxic power dynamic, that confuses your basic capacity to feel as though you have agency. And in the Ashtanga world, you couldnt say around the breakfast table at Mysore: He sexually assaulted me. Theres people who are at certain points in their career where they can say, well, Im not going to work with so and so anymore, and they can make that public and that will be very, very effective. Its harrowing to read. In Herman Melville 's novel " The Confidence-Man ," from 1857, the title character is a shapeshifter who remakes himself in the image of others' desires.

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